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'Why are you such an angry, white male?' they ask


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An e-mail newsletter item from state Rep. Mark Buesgens, R-Jordan:

Dear Friends and Neighbors,

During this past legislative session, one of my DFL colleagues asked me, “Representative Buesgens, why are you such an angry, white male?” At the time I just assumed he was tired of hearing me talk about how raising taxes during a recession is a bad idea. After all, there were so many tax increases up for debate this year that I did have to give a lot of speeches in defense of economic freedom.

But more than a month removed from the end of session, I’ve had some time to reflect back on my colleague’s question and maybe he was onto something. I am Caucasian, there’s nothing I can do about that. Same goes for being male. That was God’s call. But the part about being angry? That took more thought.

Am I angry because our economic liberties are continually being threatened? Our country set itself apart by championing the belief that a free people given the liberty to chart a course of their choosing would lead to unparalleled prosperity, and it has. We climbed higher faster than anyone would have foreseen in 1776. So yes, I am angry when I see the government taking more and more of our economy for itself through continually high taxes and unprecedented intrusion into industry.

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Am I angry because the Legislature spent five months in session and produced no tangible progress toward improving the economy? The message from Democrats to taxpayers this session was demoralizing, telling us that even though times are tough we need to squeeze our wallets a little harder to sustain the government’s spending appetite. Every dollar of spending is sancrosanct to the enablers of government. Every artistic water fountain, every road to nowhere serves a vital public purpose in their view. And what did the Legislature do to remedy the situation?

Nothing. Governor Pawlenty had to finally step in and put a stop to the madness. So yes, I am angry that our Legislature was unable to get its job done.

Speaking of jobs, I am certainly not happy to see more and more jobs disappearing from Minnesota. Just last week we learned of a company that intends to expand in Omaha because the city is willing to dole out so-called “stimulus” money as a reward. Losing a company to another state is one thing. Having it lured away with our tax dollars is outrageous. We should all be upset about that.

Upon this reflection, I am not angry due to my ethnicity or my gender, but because the principles our state and nation stand for are being stomped on and swept aside. Our foundation of personal liberty and economic freedom saw us through tough times in the past and can do so again. Maybe if a few more people are upset enough to make their voices heard – no matter their gender or ethnicity – we can get back on the right track…toward prosperity.




We need more in the...

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We need more in the Legislature and in Congress with the Common Sense of Rep. Buesgens. Until that happens he is right there will be nothing more than a continual assault on our freedoms, liberties, and checkbooks all in the name of bigger government and tax and spend. Wake up taxpayers and families before its too late! Good email Mark and right on!


Submitted by dapa2 on July 2, 2009 - 8:48pm.

Just call me happy and...

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Just call me happy and thankful.I am happy and thankful to have a family that is healthy and happy,and living in a country that is free. We have so much to be thankful for in this country that I am often at a loss when I see so many on the far right and far left who are so angry.

These extremes often share a belief that America is going to hell in a handbag (albeit for different reasons) because of the actions of the other side.

I agree with Representative Buesgans in what sets America apart from other nations,personal and economic freedoms and the sacrifices that go with it. However, I a have love of history, and if one studies American history they will find that many of the problems of today pale in comparison of what our early citizens went through.

There have been many intrusions on our freedoms throughout our history. We have had numerous intrusions on our economic freedoms since 1776 from the government and from major players within our capitalist system. We have had even more serious intrusions on our personal freedoms,both during war and peace time. while Lincoln and Roosevelt go down in history as great Presidents, they were not above locking up citizens with no trial for misguided national security reasons.

We have had several recessions and depressions in our history, some far more serious then what we have today. The biggest difference is that we have a safety net today,one can be poor and jobless today without neccessarily being homeless and starving like they were earlier in our history but that did require greater government involvement.

Many of my friends on the left feel that government needs to take a far greater role in our society and that we must spend more to make that happen. Many of my friends on the right, who like Representative Buesgans seem to think that government spending or taxes of any kind are inheritantly wrong. I think both extremes miss the mark.

America has always been a country that has had alot of big ideas and dreams. If our government had never spent the money it did on infrastucture and on vital programs we would all be living in crowded cities on the east coast. We never would have gotten over the Appalachian Mountains,we never would have would have completed the deals for the Louisiana or Alaskan Purchases, we never would have built our highways, railroads, or the Panama Canal that connect our national all of which were "roads to nowhere" at the time.

That being said I am very concerned about our government being too involved in our personal and economic lives and very wary of government ownership of businesses or property and have little faith in it's stewardship over them.

I am happy and thankful however because America has gone through all of this before. Our nation has managed to overcome the mismanagement of the both the Republicans and the Democrats and believe me,it takes two parties to really screw things up like they are today. On this 4th of July, I take comfort in knowing that we as Americans will make it through these trying times. We always do,because take care of ourselves, we help each other out and we don't take politicians too seriously.


Submitted by RichardThomas on July 5, 2009 - 12:00pm.

Richard, so pleased to read...

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Richard, so pleased to read that you and your family are well. I agree with most everything you cited in your comment with the exception of the last phrase: “we don't take politicians too seriously.”
I submit that is a primary reason we do not avoid many of the challenges that government places to our societal success – and the success of each of us and our loved ones to pursue happiness in our own ways.
I understand that you may have over the years reached a feeling that politicians can be worked around to accomplish good things – and that is a result of our liberty. But, I suspect you would agree that with liberty comes responsibility. And in a representative government the politicians are our representatives. Their decisions impact our lives. And they should be held to a higher standard.
Allow me to make just one point: the “angry” author probably is not as angry as he could be. With the stroke of a pen, he increased his daily session per diem payments by over 16% over the previous biennium – and he now takes the $77 daily session payment on holidays while saying “we need to squeeze our wallets a little harder to sustain the government’s spending appetite.”
We really do need to take our politicians seriously.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 7, 2009 - 6:43am.

Thank you for your kind...

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Thank you for your kind words Tom. Indeed, I do agree with you that with liberty comes responsibilty and that our elected officials should held to a hire standard. I also take politics seriously, I just take what politicians say with a grain of salt.

You have served in the legislature and you know that true statesmen and stateswomen lead by example. They don't lecture,they don't judge they get things done.

One of my favorite legislators was Senator (now Judge)Knutson.He was conservative both fiscally and socially yet he had very productive legislative career passing numerous bills despite being in the minority his whole legislative career. He did it by being an honest,friendly,likable guy who kept his word and led by example. He had plenty of issues with those on the other side who didn't share his views but he was respectful to them and he earned their respect and cooperation despite being in the minority.

Now days I see more and more politicians who act like entertainers. They talk about family values then cheat on their spouses. They talk about the evils of government while they collect a government check and they talk about how important their work in government is, yet they never seem to pass any meaningful legislation. When someone runs for public office I want to know what they are going to do when they get there, when I talk to an elected official that has served a term or two I expect to hear what they have accomplished without a bunch of excuses.

I am thankful that there are a few happy warriors out there in local and state government that are serious about doing the right thing.They rollup their sleeves and quietly work to get the people's business done instead of all the partisan bickering. Unfortunately they are few and far between, and their voices often get drown out by the angry bickering of those on the fringes of both parties.


Submitted by RichardThomas on July 7, 2009 - 3:39pm.

Richard, I had the honor of...

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Richard, I had the honor of serving when then State Senator Howard Knutson served. I believe he sought the U.S. Congressional seat in 1974 as an Independent-Republican (that’s what Republicans were called at that time). His legislative career began at a time when there was no party designation for the legislative offices. I think legislative partisanship was muted compared to today. His legislative career began in the House for two terms and then he served in the State Senate. He was the Independent-Republican candidate for Attorney General when I first ran for the legislature in 1978. He retired from the State Senate in 1990. Howard passed away in October of 2006.
I was fortunate to spend some time with Howard and his wife Jerry over the course of my legislative career. He was in many respects a role model for me. I was honored, for example, to be the only Republican legislative committee chairperson during the 1981-82 session.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 8, 2009 - 6:55am.

I was actually referring to...

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I was actually referring to his son,Dave who served in the legislature after you did.Both served honorably. but Dave served as Republican.


Submitted by RichardThomas on July 9, 2009 - 12:51pm.

Ok to be fair here on the...

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Ok to be fair here on the per diem issue Rep. Buesgens did not have a chance to vote on the per diem increase this was passed in Rules Committee and all House Members were never given a chance to vote publicly on it.

So when you look at the per diem for 2008 - last year it is fully available, Rep. Buesgens is near the bottom in total per diem so he is very much so looking out for the taxpayers pocket book.

Buesgens also supported and voted for the reduction in per diem on the House Floor which procedural was killed by referring it to Rules Committee.

I agree with Ronald Reagan's view of government in his Inaugaration Address which is as important today as ever, "Now, so there will be no misunderstanding, it is not my intention to do away with government. It is, rather, to make it work--work with us, not over us; to stand by our side, not ride on our back. Government can and must provide opportunity, not smother it; foster productivity, not stifle it."


Submitted by dapa2 on July 7, 2009 - 8:02am.

Concerning the “per...

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Concerning the “per diem” issue I broached previously. Allow me to try to set the record straight: When the House Rules Committee in 2007 set the $77 per session day payment Representative Buesgens was a member of the committee. To his credit, he resisted the increase from $66 per session day. After unsuccessfully trying to keep the session daily per diem payment the same as the previous biennium, he became a plaintiff in a lawsuit against the House Rules Committee and others in state government claiming the increase was a salary increase. This question had been adjudicated, if I recall, in 1977 and the courts ruled against the then plaintiffs as the court also ruled in Representative Buesgens’ action 30 years later. Of note is that Representative Emmer (now gubernatorial candidate Emmer) was also a plaintiff. At the time of the suit, Representative Emmer refunded the per diem payments he had accepted in excess of $66 per session day. Representative Emmer then continued his requested per diem rate of $66 in 2009 for the current biennium while Representative Buesgens requested the highest amount of $77 per day resulting in over a 16% increase in his daily rate. Representative Buesgens signed the request to the House finance office that included Holidays for per diem payments during the session which he had not asked for the previous biennium.
No one – not even DFLers - force any member of the House to take any per diem. I did not take any per diem payments during my three terms in the House. I did not take per diem payments during Special Sessions, as State Senator Robling chose not to accept such payments, while Representative Buesgens did.
If I am not mistaken it was only a few years ago that Representative Buesgens was if not the highest, certainly among the highest recipients of per diem payments for metro legislators.
So, as I stated before - Allow me to make just one point: the “angry” author probably is not as angry as he could be. With the stroke of a pen, he increased his daily session per diem payments by over 16% over the previous biennium – and he now takes the $77 daily session payment on holidays while saying “we need to squeeze our wallets a little harder to sustain the government’s spending appetite.”
We really do need to take our politicians seriously.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 8, 2009 - 7:00am.

I figure if they fear the...

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elkes4's picture

I figure if they fear the words, then the words are too close to the painful truth. As for the Angry White Male part, you have to wonder how much of a racist the person doing the phrase coining is, as they need to fling a stereotype of an angry white male.

Perhaps those who say this should might wish to reflect on their ethics and what it is they stand for?

I say “Give ‘em HELLP Mark” God knows they need it.


Submitted by elkes4 on July 7, 2009 - 10:35pm.

Tom, As a former Legislator...

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Tom,

As a former Legislator and one that did not take per diem you certainly have a right to your opinion. However, to make the assertion that, "Representative Buesgens was if not the highest, certainly among the highest recipients of per diem payments for metro legislators." Do you have facts to back that up or is that your opinion? I checked 2008 and he was one of the lowest. In 2007 where there was a special session he took what..... $132.00 during the special session and just over $8,000 total way less than half of those at the top taking per diems. In 2006 prior to change and as a Committee chair he was below the median per diem at $5,412 and had one of the lowest interim per diems. I certainly can review more years by requesting the data.

And while you don't like the no new tax pledge he has every right to acknowledge or even pledge that he will not raise taxes.

I know your major issue with Mark is Racino and gambling. I recall reading the fact that you regretted voting yes on the Constitutional Amendment to allow gambling. No the Constitutional Amendment question was not wrong, what was wrong is the exclusive gambling arrangement signed by Perpich and negotitated by the Public Safety Commissioner in my opinion.

I think the voters have spoken in the two challenges you raised to Mark. And simply because the party platform says no to expanding gambling I would doubt that everything in the platform you support 100% either.

It all comes down to government living within its means. Rep. Buesgens has done a good job at fighting for controlling government spending regardless of what a former state representative says here. Making trivial assertions are outside of the big picture of Mark working for and protecting District families, taxpayers and businesses and not against them as you are being led to believe. The families in our area can't afford more tax increases, no planning, no priorities, and single issue minded politicians.

Mark has done an admirable job looking out for families, taxpayers, and businesses first which is not what I can say about the legislature as a whole the last few years!


Submitted by dapa2 on July 8, 2009 - 8:56am.

You should have gone back...

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You should have gone back one more year to the first year of the 2005-6 biennium - a more fair comparison to 2009 or 2007 (when he unsuccessfully sued the components of state government). I believe you will find that when the meals provided by the Education Committee are added back into the per diem payments Representative Buesgens ties for the top recipient for regular session per diem payments. When you add the special session payments he is the top metro legislator recipient (tied for fourth overall).
Good work on your research!
Oh, and I read that Representative Buesgens has taken on a new role as Chairperson for Representative Emmer's gubernatorial campaign.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 9, 2009 - 5:54am.

I was going to let the...

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I was going to let the “trivial” comment pass until I thought of my kids and how they can’t just submit a form and raise a component of their pay 16%+.
I stand by my previous statement: : the “angry” author probably is not as angry as he could be. With the stroke of a pen, he increased his daily session per diem payments by over 16% over the previous biennium – and he now takes the $77 daily session payment on holidays while saying “we need to squeeze our wallets a little harder to sustain the government’s spending appetite.”
We really do need to take our politicians seriously.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 9, 2009 - 6:28am.

And just as each year the...

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elkes4's picture

And just as each year the Christmas advertisements seem to come earlier and earlier, so do the political contenders. Tom, I do not have anything against you, however I thought it was a nice change that we offer some appreciation to upstanding politicians prior to any mud slinging.

I am not too into researching every penny spent or its reasoning, I tend to vote for those who I deem have a moral sense and conviction to their words and yes, I believe you also may have that, however I prefer the bar be raised, not lowered when it comes to extracting information about our representatives. That is not to say exposing negligent behavior is out of line, it just means we as the public are tired from the last political bout that just ended.

Instead of tossing out negatives, lets hear some positive things to enlighten us. So what do you have Tom?


Submitted by elkes4 on July 9, 2009 - 3:34pm.

Elkes4, I have great respect...

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Elkes4, I have great respect for many politicians that I know or who I have served with. I had the honor, for example, of having for my campaign chairperson for one campaign State Senator Robling’s father. I have watched Senator Robling become an influential member of our State Senate in a quiet, principled, effective manner doing honor to our area.
Believe it or not, politicians have staff that work to make the politicians look good – not bring up some less than flattering facts.
Representative Buesgens is usually effective when talking about such principles as limited government. He seems to have adopted the philosophy that by not raising state taxes government will ultimately become ineffective resulting not in anarchy but freedom. . (I have visited places in this world where there is no government and seen the “individual freedom” the people have living in that political environment - they would trade places with you in a heartbeat.) Of course the bad news is that local government and schools are then placed in the unenviable circumstance of cutting needed services or raising property taxes.
Obviously you and I have different ways of judging our representatives. My experience and training was to be aware of the “real” actions and be cautious of the “talk” of those seeking my trust. For example, if the investors in the Madoff scheme would have researched the action rather than the talk Mr. Madoff may have gone to jail a long time ago. When the SEC was advised of Madoff’s scheme years ago nobody could believe it because he had been a leader at NASDAC. Madeoff was one of the “community” so the regulators saw Madoff to “have a moral sense and conviction to” his words and did not wish to look at the facts. You know how that turned out.
There is a reason that the information about our elected representatives is public: It is so information can be obtained (preferably by a free press) so voters may decide the trust they wish to place in their representatives. When an elected official complains about “taxes” and repeatedly neglects paying them on time he sets a model for others to follow. When a legislator fails to file required campaign information on time and is fined hundreds and hundreds of dollars for his failure to comply with the statute – not once but several times over the last three election cycles - this is something that I wish to know about my elected representative. When a legislator works for the government and uses government resources for his campaign I believe that is relevant to his stewardship of my tax money. I find it curious that in the last several years on Representative Buesgens campaign reports that a substantial amount of his campaign funds come from outside the district. And when a legislator does not attend meetings of his caucus he fails to share with his colleagues his insights thereby reducing his influence in the caucus and isolating himself from the process. Also, it is not collegial to accuse your colleagues of being “thieves” or referring to an amendment offered by another legislator as “stupid.” The result: In the 2007-2008 legislative session according to the House website fourteen bills were chief authored by Representative Buesgens, seven were requested hearings by Representative Buesgens, one bill was heard by a committee and tabled with no action.
I appreciate your giving my service the benefit of the doubt. I confess, I did have a bill for economic development for Belle Plaine vetoed by then Governor Perpich.
Thank you for the opportunity for this civil discourse.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 10, 2009 - 8:40am.

No one state senator or...

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Mathias Baden's picture

No one state senator or representative has been sheltered from Buesgens' opinion. Buesgens speaks on the floor very often, and I think that's a highly appropriate way to conduct business. I'm sorry that some people don't like his style. In the interest of public openness, I would say that it is better to have discussions on the House floor than it is to present a united front after a closed caucus meeting.

I'm not sure which amendments were "stupid," according to Buesgens, but in truth, some of them -- not most of them -- are stupid. Sometimes, even representatives need to be called out.

I'm not at all following your Buesgens-Madoff comparison. I disagree.

(Mathias Baden is the editor of the Jordan Independent. He can be reached at editor@jordannews.com.)


Submitted by Mathias Baden on July 11, 2009 - 1:56pm.

Editor Baden, I certainly do...

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Editor Baden, I certainly do not wish to have anyone censor Representative Buesgens from making whatever comments he chooses on the House floor or in committee hearings. He does provide an important perspective on many issues. I appreciate your sorrow that “some people do not like his style.” May I suggest that the people I am concerned mostly about are his colleagues that might make a difference when it comes to things that are important to our district. Being a legislator, I suspect, is still really a “people” business. At least that was my experience. I only heard him once refer to an amendment as “stupid.” Imagine if it was your amendment that was so characterized. How would you feel? How would your constituents feel about such a comment?
Regarding your concern about public openness, you must have a low opinion of legislators if you think that because they say something in a caucus setting – open or closed – that it will deter them from making their point or observation before the whole assembly. Are you familiar with the concept of “herding cats?” Legislators are strong-willed and take direction grudgingly. With very few exceptions, during my experience serving in the majority, minority and at parity, I do not recall any of my caucus members doing anything in caucus but try to contribute to the knowledge base of the group enabling a better result. By choosing not to participate in the caucus discussion and sharing his knowledge, especially in the area of education, Representative Buesgens, I submit, does a disservice to his colleagues by not allowing them to be as prepared and informed to discuss issues important to our state.
I apologize for my inability to be more concise in the Buesgens-Madoff comparison. The point I was seeking is that it is the details of one’s professional career that are as important or more so than the oratory. If you ignore the details, you do not do service to Representative Buesgens to help him be better and more effective at his job. One of my greatest detractors while I served is one of my friends today. Honest criticism made me a better Representative. I even remember local newspaper editors that would harshly criticize me for one stand or another both in print and in person. Admittedly, most of the critique given me over the years allowed me to be a smarter and a better representative. I trust that Representative Buesgens has taken my observations in the same way.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 13, 2009 - 8:20am.

Tom, Can you tell me how...

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Tom,

Can you tell me how many bills that minority authors had heard in committee in 2007-2008? You are critical of Rep. Buesgens but just want to know if you have done your homework. Everybody here knows you do not like Mark.

Now it appears you are critical of Rep. Buesgens raising funds but when I look at your campaign disclosures for you running against Rep. Buesgens you only raised $105 other than your own money in 2006. So I am not so sure you don't just have a personal issue with Mark as there are not a host of other Republicans or Conservatives lining up behind you.

Time to move on Tom, time to move on.


Submitted by dapa2 on July 10, 2009 - 11:43am.

Dapa2, I am sorry that you...

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Dapa2, I am sorry that you have interpreted my remarks concerning Representative Buesgens as some kind of dislike for the gentleman. I am equally sorry that “everybody here knows you do not like Mark” – wherever “here” is. On the contrary, I have great empathy for him. I served in the legislature while raising three young children – two of them were born while I was in office. I understand from first hand experience how serving can result in career jeopardy. I appreciate the financial stress on your family that can result from doing the job. I have no rancor towards Representative Buesgens as a person – State Senator Robling told me that it was her that recruited him to seek the office originally. If she has such respect for him as a person, I certainly would not question her assessment. I only know the man from a few personal exchanges and from watching him in committee and on the House floor.
Regarding your comment that you do not see “a host of other Republicans or Conservatives lining up behind” me: All I can say is why would you as a Republican or Conservative care about a few trifling matters of campaign or legislative conduct when his vote is reliably more libertarian. I would suggest that no local Republican Party member would question any action of a sitting Executive Committee member who is also a member of the Legislature if you want any future in the local party.
As to your comment about the Republican House members’ bills heard in Committee last biennium, I don’t really care about any of the other House members. I care about the individual that represents me and my family. If you wish to check the record, may I suggest the most reliable comparison is probably those minority legislators with five or more terms in office to see the relative success of Representative Buesgens.
Regarding my fundraising, I knew from the outset that I was fighting a losing battle in challenging Representative Buesgens in a primary race. I did not take public financing, nor did anyone solicit any contributions. Representative Buesgens could campaign on a wholesale level while I had to reach potential primary voters on the retail level. I had great fun spending time meeting the people of the district while mastering the transportation mode provided by a Segway - skinned knees and all. You know – “Politician on a stick.” Did you check my spending for 2008? Did you note the difference in the vote percentage from 2006 to 2008?
I trust that the communications that I have had with Representative Buesgens this year, for example, were of value to him and his campaign funding.
I appreciate your caring about the representation you have.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 13, 2009 - 8:35am.

Tom Rees has a problem with...

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Tom Rees has a problem with understanding reality.

It has been explained to him many times but his obvious personal dislike for Mark and others has clouded his judgement.

He has repeated in different form:
"Sitting Executive Committee member who is also a member of the Legislature "

So one more time I will explain it to him that no member of the state legislature is a sitting executive committee member with any power.

The executive committee of SD35 (Scott County) is set up like most every other executive committee in the state at all levels.

Every elected official at the level is made an ex-oficio NON-VOTING memeber of the committee.

Tom seems to think that by having the members that we elect be Non-Voting members, they can have some great powerful influence over all the decisions.

The real reason is that it allows them to give legislative reports without the necissity of granting them a voice at each meeting they attend.

They can't vote, can't make motions, can't do anything but give a report when we ask them to.

But as other have already noted, Tom's personal issues have clouded his judgement.


Submitted by Robert Thibodeaux on July 13, 2009 - 9:10am.

Robert Thibodeaux is a...

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Robert Thibodeaux is a multi-talented gentleman. He is Representative Buesgens Campaign Chair, he is the “Savage Republican” blogger, he is the Secretary of the 35th Senate District Republican Party of Minnesota Basic Political Organizational Unit and just an all around good guy! However, it seems he may need to sharpen his secretarial skills in regard to his understanding of Robert’s Rules of Order.
The local Republican Party Constitution from Article IV states: “The SD 35 Republicans BPOU Executive Committee shall, at the initial meeting following each 35th Senate District Republican Party of Minnesota BPOU Convention, establish a calendar of regular monthly meetings. There shall be no quorum call at these meetings. ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER, NEWLY REVISED, shall govern all proceedings.”
And there are two important items Mr. Thibodeaux is in error in his recent post:
1. I have no personal dislike for Representative Buesgens. His choices as to how he conducts himself in the office of State Representative and as a candidate for such office are different than mine as the clearly record shows. Most notably I do not believe that in this fiscally trying time that I would reward myself with a hefty 16% plus daily per diem rate increase over last year while suggesting that state government live within its means! I know, what is 16% daily per diem rate increase for one six-term legislator in a state budget of billions! No one else is getting hurt by the tough budget and unallotment choices currently being enacted. So, certainly there is no reason for my Representative to tighten his belt!
2. I suggest that Mr. Thibodeaux, a frequent reader and one who likes to quote the rule book, visit the official Robert’s Rules of Order website and check this out:
http://www.robertsrules.com/faq.html#2

Can ex-officio members vote, and are they counted in determining whether a quorum is present?

Answer:
"Ex officio" is a Latin term meaning "by virtue of office or position." Ex-officio members of boards and committees, therefore, are persons who are members by virtue of some other office or position that they hold. For example, if the bylaws of an organization provide for a Committee on Finance consisting of the treasurer and three other members appointed by the president, the treasurer is said to be an ex-officio member of the finance committee, since he or she is automatically a member of that committee by virtue of the fact that he or she holds the office of treasurer.

Without exception, ex-officio members of boards and committees have exactly the same rights and privileges as do all other members, including, of course, the right to vote. There are, however, two instances in which ex-officio members are not counted in determining the number required for a quorum or in determining whether or not a quorum is present. These two instances are:

1. In the case of the president, whenever the bylaws provide that the president shall be an ex-officio member of all committees (except the nominating committee); and

2. If the ex-officio member is not a member, officer, or employee of the society (for example, when the governor of a state is made ex officio a member of a private college board).

Again, however, it should be emphasized that in these instances the ex-officio member still has all of the rights and privileges of membership, including the right to vote. [RONR (10th ed.), p. 466-67; p. 480, l. 18-27.]

And Mr. Thibodeaux, I am still awaiting your “thank you.”
Tom Rees
P.S. Mr. Thibodeaux, please let Chairman Johnson know that my family members and I have already received our Political Contribution Refund for the contributions I told him we were making before the program was unallotted.


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 17, 2009 - 7:39am.

Apparently I will need to...

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Apparently I will need to add reading skills to the things that are lacking.

So to make sure it is clear to others (I believe this will be the 14th time for one person.)

In the document quoted about, The constitution of the party, It lists executive committee members:
The final Item:
"Republican State Senator and State Representatives of Senate District 35 as Ex-Officio, non-voting officers"

Just to be clear for Tom.
Non: not, other than, the reverse of.
Non-voting means they can not vote.

Not sure how that is hard to understand, but as I said it appears that personal issues have clouded judgment.


Submitted by Robert Thibodeaux on July 17, 2009 - 8:11am.

For those of you just...

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For those of you just joining us, let’s review where we are:

Robert Thibodeaux is a multi-talented gentleman. He is
 Representative Mark Buesgens Campaign Chair,
 the “Savage Republican” blogger,
 the Secretary of the 35th Senate District Republican Party of Minnesota Basic Political Organizational Unit, and
 just an all around good guy!

Statements made earlier by Mr. Thibodeaux:

“In the document quoted about, The constitution of the party, It lists executive committee members:
The final Item: ‘Republican State Senator and State Representatives of Senate District
35 as Ex-Officio, non-voting officers’
Just to be clear for Tom. Non: not, other than, the reverse of. Non-voting means they can not vote.”

“They (mentioned above: Republican State Senator and State Representatives of Senate District35) can't vote, can't make motions, can't do anything but give a report when we ask them to.”

I have previously cited: “The local Republican Party Constitution from Article IV states: ‘The SD 35 Republicans BPOU Executive Committee shall, at the initial meeting following each 35th Senate District Republican Party of Minnesota BPOU Convention, establish a calendar of regular monthly meetings. There shall be no quorum call at these meetings. ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER, NEWLY REVISED, shall govern all proceedings.’”

And I cited: “… the official Robert’s Rules of Order website and check this out:
http://www.robertsrules.com/faq.html#2

Can ex-officio members vote, and are they counted in determining whether a quorum is present?

Answer:
‘Ex officio’ is a Latin term meaning ‘by virtue of office or position.’ Ex-officio members of boards and committees, therefore, are persons who are members by virtue of some other office or position that they hold.’
…2. If the ex-officio member is not a member, officer, or employee of the society (for example, when the governor of a state is made ex officio a member of a private college board).

Again, however, it should be emphasized that in these instances the ex-officio member still has all of the rights and privileges of membership, including the right to vote. [RONR (10th ed.), p. 466-67; p. 480, l. 18-27.]”

So, (I wish some logical lady could help with this) Mr. Thibodeaux states the elected representatives of the people of Senate District 35 “can't do anything but give a report when we ask them to.” This directly conflicts with the Constitution quoted by Mr. Thibodeaux that says according to Robert’s Rules of Order they as ex-officio members “member still has all of the rights and privileges of membership” but the vote is stripped from them by the Constitution!

Now as I understand, this SD 35 Republican organization we have been writing about is a political organization. And Mr. Thibodeaux, an officer of this political organization, wants us to believe that the Executive Committee of the political organization does not want input from a successful publisher who sits on a college board? Or a successful writer that knows a lot about Scott County and was formerly a local newspaper editor? Or a gentleman that is a small business owner and has decades of experience in the Minnesota education system?

Please, Mr. Thibodeaux, confirm that according to Robert’s Rules of Order, you cannot stifle an ex-officio member (even a “non-voting” member) from offering motions or imparting wisdom to the committee.

Does your organization not wish to take advantage of the wealth of wisdom and experience these three individuals would provide?

(At this point I should be thankful that you did not want to have the experience and wisdom of previous Scott County elected Republican legislators included in the Excecutive Committee membership!)

Help me understand why you would squander such a valuable people resource?

May I suggest that the typical non-voting ex-officio member of a generic committee or board is usually an employee of the organization.

And as stated above the Executive Committee sets its own meeting dates. I believe the Executive Committee probably meets in secret as I have not seen an entry on the official SD 35 Republican calendar for such meetings. And as you know minutes of the Executive Committee are not publicly available.

Now allow me to apply some logic: The Volunteers for Mark Buesgens Committee transferred last year some $3,000 (about 40% of the Public Subsidy money the campaign received) to the SD 35 Party that we have been discussing, providing moneys for expenditures like paying employees per diem.

So assuming that the reason for the non-voting status is to allow employees payment of, say, per diem payments to any of those legislators that ask for the daily payments when they may be doing SD 35 Party work.

We know that State Representative Mark Buesgens increased his legislative per diem payments by over 16% for 2009 from the year before. I wonder does he also get $77 a day for SD 35 Republican Party work from the local party?

I also see an interesting organizational innovation. Quoted above from the SD 35 Constitution is: “There shall be no quorum call at these meetings.” I know that you were not at the 2007 BPOU annual meeting when this Constitutional change was proposed and adopted. I spoke against it; blogger Amendment X, aka Randy Penrod -a current SD 35 Party officer, also tried to convince the assembled delegates that this was not a good idea. Unfortunately, we were unsuccessful.

Conceivably, this means that one person – and maybe not even the Chair – could conduct business, pay per diem to employees, and otherwise make decisions for the entire organization. Kind of scary to put all this power in one person’s hands, don’t you think? Is that good representative Republican philosophy applied to the Party?

And thank you for setting me straight on the “non” stuff. I read it in the Constitution but I thought it was a misprint on the copy I received for the reasons cited above.

I can hardly believe that the SD 35 Republican Party would be paying employee per diem to an elected official like State Representative Mark Buesgens.

Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 18, 2009 - 2:56pm.

You had me at "Angry, White...

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You had me at "Angry, White Male". Which ever side of the political aisle you are on there is absolutely no reason in this day and age to be referring to someone's race and gender with the word angry. I've had it with reverse racism against white males.


Submitted by Lilith on July 13, 2009 - 12:00pm.

Thank you for the Roberts...

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elkes4's picture

Thank you for the Roberts Rules of Order... I don't know why but it seems to be popping up in my daily conversations.... not to be used, but just some of the proper usages.

I learned on Hank Hill that if one of the voters leaves before the meeting is closed, they then forfeit their vote, they were arguing on toilets in the show, HI flush and Low volume.... quite fitting for most political realms and too often I wish we had a HI flush when it came to many political issues.

Now I know!


Submitted by elkes4 on July 17, 2009 - 9:54am.

Yep, Tom is definably not...

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elkes4's picture

Yep, Tom is definably not feeling the love for Mark…. So now, “who is being angry?” and aside from mounting a political campaign…. “Why?”


Submitted by elkes4 on July 18, 2009 - 6:34pm.

“Why?” you inquire,...

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“Why?” you inquire, elkes4. That is a legitimate question. Perhaps because I am one of the few Scott County residents that have served as a legislator and know what the choices are when you are serving. Most people without legislative experience or some close association cannot appreciate or recognize what importance personal choices during your term in office may be to what is important to the legislator. I am not a faithful reader of the local newspaper, but how many stories did you see about the 16% plus increase in daily per diem payments that Representative Mark Buesgens requested and received? If you think while Scott County employees reduced their request for a pay increase that Representative Buesgens’ increase is not relevant? Maybe you can simple fill out a form and get compensation increased, most people in the real world cannot.
I should challenge you to demonstrate the anger you seem to feel I am manifesting. You are not challenging the accuracy of my comments. Typically when someone is unable to refute facts they adopt a strategy of attacking the messenger. It seems to me that is your strategy.
Tom Rees
P.S. I probably have a better understanding of the challenges of a legislator with a family than most people so I do have love for Mark and his family and trust that the pressures of public service are manageable. The point I was seeking is that it is the details of one’s professional career that are as important or more so than the oratory. If you ignore the details, you do not do service to Representative Buesgens to help him be better and more effective at his job. One of my greatest detractors while I served is one of my friends today. Honest criticism made me a better Representative. Admittedly, most of the critique given me over the years allowed me to be a smarter and a better representative. I trust that Representative Buesgens will accept my observations in the same way.


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 23, 2009 - 7:10am.

Again this is turning into...

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Again this is turning into something less than beneficial by Mr. Rees. Arguing over beneficial???

Having been around for sometime myself and served in a variety of capacities dealing with ex-officio members I couldnt disagree more with Tom. " Without exception, ex-officio members of boards and committees have exactly the same rights and privileges as do all other members, including, of course, the right to vote."

Ex-officion of course is universal meaning, "the holding a position or membership due to the power or influence of one's office, and not by election or appointment." A chairperson, for example, can be an ex-officio member of all board appointed committees. However, such positions and their attached voting and other privileges are detailed in the bylaws of the organization.

I think it is fruitless to argue what is in Roberts Rules as those rules may apply to everything but what is spelled out otherwise. I would think most Executive Committees have sitting members are ex-officios with non-voting power as these are the people that have the responsibility of managing the BPOU when the Full Committee is not meeting and shall prepare a budget for the Full Committee. The Executive Committee shall prepare a plan to implement party activities and find, build, and elect candidates in December of each year and present that plan to the Full Committee for amendment and approval in January of each year.


Submitted by dapa2 on July 18, 2009 - 6:40pm.

This is just a glimpse of...

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This is just a glimpse of the "reality" of dealing with Mr. Rees.
Everything is a vast conspiracy, some evil cabal - I assume he can also hears the black helicopters we send to monitor his house :)

If it didn't waste so much time and county resources (such as his filing to run, then leaving the country) it would be funny.

Not to confuse Mr. Rees with facts - something that has proven useless, but for others who may be interested.

I was Mr. Buesgens campaign chairman, a position I took because Mr. Rees filed to run as a Republican.

One of the reasons was that during that period the only person who seemed to be supporting him and the person who Mr. Rees used as his sole campaign consultant is a paid consultant of the DFL Senate caucus. It raised concerns about the real reasons Mr. Rees was running.

As has became apparent over time - his personal reasons for running appear to be more based on his lack of judgment and hold on reality.

Not to confuse things with other facts, but it appears that Mr. Rees is the only one who has trouble finding or staying for meetings. They are held at the same time and place they have been for the last 3+ years. Also at the last two conventions about 100+ new people have run for various State, Congressional and local party delegations and leadership positions. If my count is correct over 60% of the executive board are people who first became active in local politics during the last election cycle. It is actually pretty exciting time for Republican politics here in Scott Country with so much new talent and ideas.

Mr. Rees can continue his rants in his own "reality".

Luckily for the rest of us, the true reality is that the voters of Scott have rejected this sort politics of personal destruction and reject people running for office to fulfill some sort of personal grudge.


Submitted by Robert Thibodeaux on July 18, 2009 - 8:11pm.

Mr. Thibodeaux, while I...

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Mr. Thibodeaux, while I don’t know what your military service may have been, I did have a “Top Secret” clearance during my service. I waited in basic training while the background and reputation check was completed. I think the FBI that checked me out would have noted any reality concerns or I would not have been granted such trust. I hope you would agree.
And I think my “reality” was just fine when Representative Beard hired me to represent him to acquire a business.
I know, you are a blogger; I did have a press card. So you are certainly a more reliable source.
I understand how tough it must be to avoid responding to facts I have reasonably presented. You once pushed for Representative Buesgens to become part of the Pawlenty administration.
As Daniel Patrick Moynihan, a four-term U.S. Senator, ambassador, administration official, and academic once said, “Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.”
As I previously presented: There is a reason that the information about our elected representatives is public: It is so information can be obtained (preferably by a free press) so voters may decide the trust they wish to place in their representatives.
When an elected official complains about “taxes” and repeatedly neglects paying them on time he sets a model for others to follow.
When a legislator fails to file required campaign information on time and is fined hundreds and hundreds of dollars for his failure to comply with the statute – not once but several times over the last three election cycles - this is something that I wish to know about my elected representative.
When a legislator works for the government and uses government resources for his campaign I believe that is relevant to his stewardship of my tax money.
I find it curious that in the last several years on Representative Buesgens campaign reports that a substantial amount of his campaign funds come from outside the district.
And when a legislator admittedly does not attend meetings of his caucus as reported on this blog he fails to share with his colleagues his insights thereby reducing his influence in the caucus and isolating himself from the process. Also, it is not collegial to accuse your colleagues of being “thieves” or referring to an amendment offered by another legislator as “stupid.” The result: In the 2007-2008 legislative session according to the House website fourteen bills were chief authored by Representative Buesgens, seven were requested hearings by Representative Buesgens, one bill was heard by a committee and tabled with no action.
And you may choose to ignore the 16% plus increase Representative Mark Buesgens choose to receive for his daily per diem payments while calling on a state government to live within its means.

And please, I do not hold any personal animosity towards Representative Mark Buesgens. You think if I was in the business of personal destruction that I would have reminded Representative Buesgens via e-mail that his 2008 Campaign Finance Report was over a month late? Fortunately he filed it a couple of days after my friendly reminder and limited his Campaign’s fine to $50 this time rather than hundreds as the previous two election cycles. You as the Campaign Chairperson probably should have been aware of the campaign late report and the attendant fine, too. I think that our area could have better representation based upon the facts I presented above.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 22, 2009 - 7:21am.

Mr. Thibodeaux, as I thought...

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Mr. Thibodeaux, as I thought further about your recent posting, I could not let one of your statements go without comment.
You stated: “If it didn't waste so much time and county resources (such as his filing to run, then leaving the country) it would be funny.”
Help me understand what wasted resources. There was going to be a lawful primary election no matter what you may believe about how our system works. I know there was no 16% plus increase of per diem that Representative Mark Buesgens could ask for from the state in this instance. I never took any per diem payments. Representative Mark Buesgens for the first year of this biennium versus the first year of the last biennium, with less days claimed, still substantially increased his daily per diem payments.
Allow me to share a little history. When I ran for the legislature against a DFLer I suspect that there were some people that felt the same as far as my candidacy (the Star Tribune probably included). But, sir, I won. And because of the victory (after a recount) Republicans shared power in the Minnesota House of Representatives for the first time since party labels were put on candidates for the legislature.
Let’s fast forward a couple terms. In 1985-6 biennium as part of the Republican House majority, we cut $1 billion in taxes for the people of Minnesota. (How much is that in today’s dollars?)
So what you stated is that you are the only one that knows what is correct for the rest of us. You suggest that you and you alone have the wisdom and understanding and experience to determine who may or may not compete for the House of Representatives. Fortunately, while you have these visions of grandeur, the real world is there to protect us from your “thought” tyranny.
Tom Rees
P.S. You stated: “Not to confuse things with other facts, but it appears that Mr. Rees is the only one who has trouble finding or staying for meetings.” How can you make that statement and suggest it is factual! How many other folks checked the Official Republican Senate District 35 calendar and found nothing?
And in response to another post I wrote: I don’t know where you obtained a responsibility statement for the Executive Committee as you stated. The “find, build, and elect candidates” portion is where I have been critical with the past leadership of the local party.
In 2006 our local precinct at the precinct caucus passed a resolution asking the leadership of the local party to immediately begin a search for candidates for the legislative offices that would stand for election later that year. Here is what Representative Mark Buesgens wrote to me shortly before his endorsement about the Republican Senate District 35 handling of the Search Committee function: concerning being the ‘anointed candidate’: “I do acknowledge that and I feel bad about it. I know that the party officers would acknowledge that they haven't done their jobs on this issue."
Our local precinct at the precinct caucus in 2008 passed a similar resolution because Representative Mark Buesgens had not indicated his intent to run for reelection after being asked. Personally, I was greatly concerned that he may not be running again because he had called me on the telephone at my home in 2006 after I filed for office and thanked me for placing my name on the ballot. He told me that he and his wife had discussed running again and they had decided not to seek reelection. He commented on the satisfaction he received from doing his job at the Charter School in St. Paul. He asked me about my stance on abortion and then said that he would have to talk to a couple of local party people and get their input but that he expected to sign a waiver to remove his name from the ballot. That was the last I heard from him in 2006 about his election. Obviously he changed his mind.
And just last month I sent a certified letter to the “new” Chairperson and he would not even pick it up from the Post Office! His predecessor likewise did not respond to a first class letter I sent to him congratulating him on his election to the Chair position. That is real engagement with others to build the party – exciting?


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 22, 2009 - 12:57pm.

Thank you, dapa2, for...

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Thank you, dapa2, for agreeing with Robert’s Rules. The local Republican BPOU operates under the constraints of their Consititution (found at http://www2.mngop.com/sd35/info.cfm?x=2&pname=seltype&pval=1&pname2=info...)
I have previously quoted from the Constitution and as it clearly states, “. ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER, NEWLY REVISED, shall govern all proceedings.”
As I stated, “Does your organization not wish to take advantage of the wealth of wisdom and experience these three individuals would provide?” I was, of course, referring to local elected legislators with many years of political experience. Senator Robling, for example, grew up in a politically active family so her experience goes back nearly 30 years that I may attest.
I don’t know where you obtained a responsibility statement for the Executive Committee as you stated. The “find, build, and elect candidates” portion is where I have been critical with the past leadership of the local party.
In 2006 our local precinct at the precinct caucus passed a resolution asking the leadership of the local party to immediately begin a search for candidates for the legislative offices that would stand for election later that year. Here is what Representative Mark Buesgens wrote to me shortly before his endorsement about the Republican Senate District 35 handling of the Search Committee function: concerning being the ‘anointed candidate’: “I do acknowledge that and I feel bad about it. I know that the party officers would acknowledge that they haven't done their jobs on this issue."
Our local precinct at the precinct caucus in 2008 passed a similar resolution because Representative Mark Buesgens had not indicated his intent to run for reelection after being asked. Personally, I was greatly concerned that he may not be running again because he had called me on the telephone at my home in 2006 after I filed for office and thanked me for placing my name on the ballot. He told me that he and his wife had discussed running again and they had decided not to seek reelection. He commented on the satisfaction he received from doing his job at the Charter School in St. Paul. He asked me about my stance on abortion and then said that he would have to talk to a couple of local party people and get their input but that he expected to sign a waiver to remove his name from the ballot. That was the last I heard from him in 2008 about his election. Obviously he changed his mind.
Thanks for your comment.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 22, 2009 - 7:15am.

A high flush is certainly in...

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A high flush is certainly in order. (Elkes, I saw that episode too)
I checked out for a couple weeks and I was surprised to see that this Republican on Republican "mauling" was still going on. I think you folks ought to; agree to disagee.

The truth is Mark Buesgens and the the Scott County Republicans owe Tom Rees a debt of gratitude. He was one of the few Republicans who had the guts to run back in the 70's when when all the Republicans (paticularly Jordan) Scott County could fit in the back of a pick-up truck. I remember, I was there.
That being said, The voters have spoken and Mark seems to win by rather comfortable margins despite the fact that he is probably more conservitive then the average Scott county voter. I think is appeal is very basic.He is very well known in his community and the people who know him, trust him. Much like former Senator Bob Schmitz who served for many years.
My point two weeks ago was that politics has gotten very personal, and those that practice politics, all too often spent more time demonizing their opponents then having a meaningful debate and actually getting anything done. The quality of the discussion here over the last two weeks proves my point. I have known both Mark and Tom for over thirty years and I believe that they are both men who have kept the promises that they made to the voters.

However, I believe the real measure of an elected official is, are they effective? Any one of us can go to St.Paul and give speeches, (and many do just that)but real statesmen actually get things done.Back when I was a lobbyist in Minnesota we used to joke about how we wish that legislators had baseball cards with their batting average because so many would introduce bills that they had know real intention of pushing and that would never get close to having an actual hearing. My point is, we all ought to find out if our legislators have a good batting average and if they are potential all-stars or if the they to be sent down because they can't hit a fast ball. Good legislators pass bills and make a difference regardless of which party is in the majority or who sits in the Governor's office.

When politicians knock on my door I don't ask them how they feel (They get a garage grilling and I don't care if they are angry,happy or sad) I ask them what they have accomplished and what do they hope to get accomplish. It's all about getting it done. The truth is, much of the work of the legislature is tedious,non-partisan and extremely unsexy. Politicians have earned the right to complain how boring the peoples work can be,but life is too short for their bs and excuses for not getting things done.


Submitted by RichardThomas on July 22, 2009 - 10:37pm.

"I'm more a libertarian than...

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"I'm more a libertarian than a Republican,'' Mark Buesgens is quoted as saying in a recent online non-profit journalism enterprise. So, Richard, this is not “Republican on Republican ‘mauling’” as you described.
I appreciate your observation about my “guts” to become the first party-labeled Republican, I believe, in the 20th Century elected from Scott County. However, it was not guts that allowed me to succeed but hard work by many talented people and luck. For example, the Northwest Airlines pilot union decided to strike the summer of 1978 allowing me the time to knock on every door in the district a couple of times.
The race for re-election in 1980 was even tougher, if you recall.
In 1982 I ran against the State Senator that I had shared representation responsibilities – an effective legislator from Jordan by the name of Bob Schmitz. The reason I ran was associated with the hazardous waste siting issue that effected our area. Senator Schmitz was otherwise an honorable, hard working legislator that chaired the Senate Transportation Committee and did a lot of good for Scott County.
As I recall, Senator Schmitz did not spend a lot of time speaking on the Senate floor but was valuable to his constituency as a majority legislator on the Finance Committee.
I understand that for you as a lobbyist that “what they have accomplished and what do they hope to get accomplish[ed]” is critical to your profession. Other mundane things like filing amicus curiea brief and paying for it with my own resources to keep PCBs in sludge from the Blue Water Treatment facility from being spread on Scott County farmland is not what lobbyists value. It is a low visibility, unlibertarian thing to do – but it was the right thing to do for Scott County.
Or how about introducing a resolution making MSP a “gateway” city to London in preference to Denver having that authority. I contend that while a resolution isn’t sexy or even “making laws,” the protection of Minnesota jobs, because of the ultimate success of the resolution, arguably allowed Northwest to remain a viable international airline for a decade or so longer than probably would have been the case if Denver had been chosen. (I could not vote on the resolution because of my employment but I could advocate for it with my colleagues while high paid lobbyists from a competing airline tried to stop the initiative.)
There were a couple of educational initiatives that I worked hard to get passed that stand today as remarkable reforms. And while the major teacher's union fought these changes I received their endorsement for re-election!
But while lobbyists do not care how a legislator conducts himself or herself as long as there are results, as a citizen you should care if a legislator increases his own daily per diem payment by more than 16% when calling for no increase in the state budget. If everyone could raise his or her compensation by just signing a request, then it would not be an issue. In these economic times everyone simply cannot. My choice was not to request per diem payments during my legislative career.
Thanks for your input to the discussion. I trust you understand my response.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 23, 2009 - 7:16am.

Sorry Tom, but from what is...

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elkes4's picture

Sorry Tom, but from what is being presented here, I may take my opinion a bit coarse. I also knew (only on a personal level) many of the people mentioned here. Bob Schmitz, Buesgen, Robling and Mr. Thomas) I have only personally met you at the fair once and you were campaigning, so I do not have a good sense to what you are about and you would be hard pressed to sway my opinion on the pre-mentioned persons.

I can not consider myself any actual party yet. I do however NOT consider myself a Democrat, right now. I can say that only because of my current research on a relative of mine named Floyd B. Olson…. Don’t worry; I am also supposed to be shirt tail to Tommy Thompson who is a republican. Recent events are making it hard for me to say that I am even a Republican as I am torn on the governmental involvement theory of the Libertarians and I am still uncertain on what they are supposed to stand for (Please don’t try to sway my insight, I will find it on my own). I am still on a quest to where I will say I am as a “Party” but I do know who I will say I am not affiliated with.

I did toss my two cents in on a local level, but did not take it too far, or serious enough to make impact. I can understand your reasoning for “what you say” I do also know that I like the things that have been said in a negative slam against Mark as I am tired of the status quo way of doing things. I would much rather have a Representative that is poking at the hot coals, than standing there with their fingers in the cake, I am still learning what or who to vote for as is all of the voters.

As for Mark, he really did tick me off once back when I was sixteen…. I have learned to let go of things and I found that you can always say something bad about anyone; the trick is to say something good, which will eventually make you a better person. I could probably find hordes of people who have something un-pleasurable to say about you. That is NOT my point. I just want the information and keep hearing the same issues repeated, “From my standpoint”. It could be just that I am uneducated in the formalities of a campaign? I don’t know.

Tom, I am not angered at you either… I have a coarse way of writing and may be slightly opinionated, but for the most of it, I think I am an “ok” average citizen, who is tired of the Mud Campaign.

I may feed out the rope, but it’s up to you what to do with it.


Submitted by elkes4 on July 23, 2009 - 8:30am.

Elkes4, thank you for your...

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Elkes4, thank you for your candid remarks. I am concerned about your characterization of my comments being a “Mud Campaign.” And you capitalized each word. Look, I will take your rope and suggest the following:
If it brings you discomfort to read about the performance while in office of your state representative then I suggest you ignore all the comments presented either by me or the incumbent representative. His job is to get reelected. My job as a citizen is to bring information to other citizens that they may not normally read about. While the Jordan newspaper does its best to cover the local news, we can no longer expect to glean public information that requires an effort to retrieve in the local new media; t takes time to access the information that would leave other important stories of a local nature untold. It is fortunate for us that the Jordan Independent provides this forum to share information.
So, because I have the experience of being in office I know where to check for information and what information is available.
For example, then five-term State Representative Mark Buesgens was honored in 2007 to be appointed to arguably the most powerful committee in the House of Representatives – the Committee on Rules and Legislative Administration. This committee oversees the operation of the House including such things as setting maximum per diem rates. (Remember, no legislator is forced to take money from the state as compensation – except for salary, communications stipend, they must request the money from the state treasury.)
The most important role may be that the Rules and Legislative Administration Committee is the setting of the agenda for the work of the House. They decide what bills will be placed on the House Calendar for discussion and potentially becoming law. For us to have our representative on that powerful committee enhances the chances of passage of legislation important to our communities.
In an earlier post I described Representative Buesgens being an unsuccessful plaintiff challenging the increase in the maximum per diem payments offered to House members as passed by the Rules and Legislative Administration Committee that he served as a member. He was plaintiff against the committee he served on.
Interestingly, in 2007 the Committee minutes show that he was “present” for 9 of 14 committee meetings and in 2008 in was “present” for 8 of 12 meetings. If you are not “present” then you are “excused” in legislative parlance. As a legislator you do not have to bring a note from a doctor or provide any reason to be “excused.” His attendance record for other committee meetings for the same period were much better.
Interestingly, he was not appointed in 2009 to the Rules Committee, a loss for us because of his lessened ability to influence the operation of the House.
You stated in an earlier post: “I am not too into researching every penny spent or its reasoning, I tend to vote for those who I deem have a moral sense and conviction to their words and yes, I believe you also may have that, however I prefer the bar be raised, not lowered when it comes to extracting information about our representatives. That is not to say exposing negligent behavior is out of line, it just means we as the public are tired from the last political bout that just ended.”
You are correct: We hire our State Senator and State Representative to watch the pennies.
I guess we are all prone to political fatigue of one sort or another. I won’t bore you with those items in the news that drive me up a wall. What I will say is that you and I have had the opportunity to have a conversation. Not a conversation like the one we may have had when you saw me campaigning at the Republican county fair booth, obviously, but an exchange of information, respectfully engaging our views.
Thank you for your patience with me.
Tom Rees
P.S. In honor of the Scott County Fair let me share an historical fact: When State Senator Bob Schmitz was first elected he was one of the first four DFL’ers with a party label elected in Minnesota history!


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 25, 2009 - 7:56am.

Feel free to give credit...

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Mathias Baden's picture

Feel free to give credit where it is due.

I fully disagree with your statements about the Jordan newspaper, which you admit you do not faithfully read. It is clear that the JI staff retrieves public information that is not easy to get; we put in maximum effort to do so every week. Those who read the paper and most of the people who read the Web site know this.

And also, let's give Buesgens credit for doing a job that is much more than merely getting re-elected. Seriously? Having served as a legislator, you must know that there is more to the job than that.

(Mathias Baden is the editor of the Jordan Independent. He can be reached at editor@jordannews.com.)


Submitted by Mathias Baden on July 26, 2009 - 9:23am.

Editor Baden, please accept...

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Editor Baden, please accept my apology if I missed your story in the Jordan Independent, probably from last January, when Representative Buesgens signed his request for a 16% plus increase in his daily per diem payments and is now accepting per diem payments on Holidays.
Allow me also to apologize for not applauding your story from 2007 covering the suit that Representative Mark Buesgens was a plaintiff against the Minnesota House of Representatives and the Rules and Legislative Administration Committee that he used to serve as a member. And of course my apology for not commending you on the story of the subsequent dismissal of the suit.
And I further apologize for not heralding you coverage of the other unsuccessful suits that State Representative Mark Buesgens has been plaintiff over the past few years – one that was dismissed by the Supreme Court as too late just last week.
Speaking of “late,” I must have missed the coverage during the last three election cycles of the campaign report filing tardiness and the attendant fines of hundreds and hundreds of dollars levied against Representative Mark Buesgens’ campaign committee.
Editor Baden, you do work hard. You do put in “maximum effort to do so every week.” I know it – even if I don’t read your paper every week. And I appreciate you allowing me to comment on the choices of Representative Mark Buesgens has made during his legislative career even though I do not live in Jordan, Sand Creek Township, Louisville Township – the coverage area you work hard to keep informed.
For nearly a year I had a press card and worked with a small local paper about the size of the JI as a columnist. I understand you do all you can do – and I think for what you are charged with doing you do a great job!
And in regard to my comment about getting re-elected as a “job” for Representative Buesgens, I submit that if you do the right things in office an incumbent legislator greatly enhances his or her chances for re-election thereby doing his or her job. Kind of like you doing the right things in your workplace to keep your job.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 27, 2009 - 7:46am.

Tom, you are right to...

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Tom, you are right to correct me on the hard work vs. guts. Your campaigns were hard fought, but it took a fair amount of guts as well. You are wrong however to assume that lobbyists do not care about how legislators conduct themselves. Because much of what happens at the Capitol happens is behind the scenes,often times it is lobbyists that expose bad behavior. They might not be the person that is quoted in the paper, but very often they are the ones that steer the media in the right direction.

Resaults are important, we don't send politicians to the Capitol just to give speeches, we expect them to get something done and I think that you have proven this point. Good legislators get things done for their constitutents and for the state. I was proud to be a lobbyist.I worked on issues that were important to Minnesota, saving them tens of millions of dollars and providing thousands of jobs. However,I was citizen active in my community as well, and as a citizen who happened to spend quite a bit of time at the Capitol I knew who were "work horses" and who were the "show horses". The "work horses" were doing many of the things you decribed, much of their work behind the scenes and without recognition, while the "show horses" gave speeches and press conferences why accomplishing very little in terms of meaningful legislation.

As for per diem,there is no good reason for any legislator in the metro area to take it unless they have some overnight trip out of state or in greater Minnesota. It is understandable that legislators from greater Minnesota who have to drive 2-4 hours to get home take per diem and housing. However if you are taking per diem and you live an hour or less from from the Capitol it is just wrong. How many average citizens can expect to get paid for going back and forth to work each day or for meals?

Frankly I was surprised that Representative Buesgens took per diem or was involved in this per diem lawsuit business. He is always talking about small government and wasteful spending that I just assumed that he didn't take per diem money. Living in Virginia, I guess don't follow Minnesota politics as close as I would like to. That being said, I shouln't be surprised, I mean Representative Kahn who lives only 5 miles from the Capitol is one of the biggest reciepients of per diem money and some in St.Paul take the money as well.

To me it is not really the money so much that is spent, it is a tiny amount in the overall budget, but rather the sense of entitlement that goes with it. I think they ought to ban it all, except for those legislators who live in greater Minnesota. At the very least, make per diem spending, a stand alone spending bill with line items for each legislator taking it. Then the media has the opportunity to report on it before the the spending occurs rather then after the fact. I don't blame the media for their coverage, it appears to me that legislators go out of there way to make sure it goes "under the radar".

In any event I learned something new about the per diem.
However I have not learned yet,is what our legislators have accomplished for all the their per diem money.


Submitted by RichardThomas on July 26, 2009 - 8:48pm.

Mr. Thomas, as I know you...

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Mr. Thomas, as I know you are not the stereotypical lobbyist your input is of greater value. I concede that our form of government would not be nearly as strong and resilient without lobbyists.
Your observation concerning "entitlement" mentality is right on. I have also heard it referred to as "Potomac Fever."
Keep on doing what you are doing.
Tom Rees


Submitted by 1ScottRep on July 27, 2009 - 7:53am.

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